SFA

At the Verona Fair GMM introduced the eXtra 37 CN2. Since then over 30 machines have been sold. The first delivery in North America will be in early January to a shop in Indiana. The eXtra is a 5 axis (interpolated) unibody saw with a rotating head. The table is 88 1/2" x 149 5/8" with an 1 1/4" thick hard foam surface and special non skid matting. A hydraulic tilting table is standard. Other features include a touch screen; laser; a center water feed motor (6,000 rpm max) with a 1/2" gas spindle for tooling; a 2 tool magazine and changer for core drills; a patented vacuum system mounted on the blade guard with digital display of vacuum and cleaning cycle prior to lifting and moving items; digital camera, tool diameter and tool length reader, slab thickness reader; Cuts from Cad and contouring programs with tool compensation, Parametric Figures which allows direct entry of complex programs on the screen using our extensive library of shapes, and a 800 w air conditioner. All this at a very, very competitive price!

Based upon the demand to date, we expect the eXtra to become our most popular saw for interior stone work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NNbVJaLa3c

John Bergman
Bergman-Blair Machine Corp / GMM USA
Prescott, AZ 86305
928-443-1100
516-381-6774 Cell
bergmanblair@gmail.com

I love our Brio Easy but it seems like GMM keeps pushing out saws that are too similar. The Intra is a Brio with the vaccum pad for moving pieces and the eXtra seems like it is an Intra with automatic depth finder and tool magazine. Maybe this is an option and tell me if I'm wrong, but couldn't they just make the Brio and offer all these extra's as addition add-ons?

Is this just a way to make more money? I know I would love to have some of these options without having to buy a new saw.
The Brio we bought was a display model and didn't have optional upgrades.

On another note. I would love to see a SawJet from GMM.

Can you get me a quote for that saw.

jbergman wrote:[img]http://www.gmm.it/1012file/prodotti/EXT ... N2%201.jpg[/Go
At the Verona Fair GMM introduced the eXtra 37 CN2. Since then over 30 machines have been sold. The first delivery in North America will be in early January to a shop in Indiana. The eXtra is a 5 axis (interpolated) unibody saw with a rotating head. The table is 88 1/2" x 149 5/8" with an 1 1/4" thick hard foam surface and special non skid matting. A hydraulic tilting table is standard. Other features include a touch screen; laser; a center water feed motor (6,000 rpm max) with a 1/2" gas spindle for tooling; a 2 tool magazine and changer for core drills; a patented vacuum system mounted on the blade guardith digital display of vacuum and cleaning cycle prior to lifting and moving items; digital camera, tool diameter and tool length reader, slab thickness reader; Cuts from Cad and contouring programs with tool compensation, Parametric Figures which allows direct entry of complex programs on the screen using our extensive library of shapes, and a 800 w air conditioner. All this at a very, very competitive price!

Based upon the demand to date, we expect the eXtra to become our most popular saw for interior stone work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NNbVJaLa3c

John Bergman
Bergman-Blair Machine Corp / GMM USA
Prescott, AZ 86305
928-443-1100
516-381-6774 Cell
bergmanblair@gmail.com

Italian companies think a bit differently than us Amercians.

They (Italians) seem to like more order and regimented processes. This drives them to think that each saw is different and unique. These options are truly the only thing that makes each model unique.

I have ofe=ten wondered why they do not build 2 saw, one a mono block and the other a traditional bridge saw. With each they could offer options like axis options, vacuum lifter, probe(s), camera, belt fed, tilt table, etc.

This would allow the client to choose the options they want. Americans, typically shop on price.

The Brio was a ground breaking saw when it came out. It brought digital cutting to the small shop. Recently (last 5 years), cnc saws has been a highly competitive market. Different companies did different things to remain (or become) successful.

I do believe more options are available on the Brio than when it first came out.

Hi Jamie,

In our industry most changes are evolutionary rather than revolutionary. I have learned the hard way that one of the basic principles of engineering is that if something works, don't fix it. The eXtra 37 incorporates does many of the features of the Brio and the Intra. However it is a unibody machine, the Intra is not, with a larger table size than either, (slabs are getting larger and larger). We have taken some of our most popular options from both machines such as a hydraulic tilting table with a foam and mat surface, slab and tool readers, vacuum and camera systems, center water feed spindle, Parametric Figures and two other programs, and added a tool changer and air conditioner as standard features. In the last two months over 30 eXtra's have been sold, and it is fast becoming our most popular saw. Being able to produce the same machine in quantity keeps costs down and the pricing is most reasonable. The exchange rate does not hurt either.

About 8 years ago GMM in conjunction with Salem explored the saw jets extensively. Initial designs were produced as well as a prototype structure. In the end it was decided to concentrate on rotating head saws, and our r & d funds (well over 3,000,000 euro) have been funneled in that direction. In our opinion was that rotating head machines out produced saw jets and avoided many of the maintenance requirements, and neither make finished items. I was very much involved in that project. Looking back, I believe that we made the right decision.

As a company we try to foresee our customer's requirements and industry trends. However it is you guys that are on the front lines, your input is vital to our mutual success. Not a day goes by where we do not learn something from our customers. The eXtra 37 is a result from such input.

John Bergman

I don't own a gmm or a saw jet. But having a few years experience tuning a twisting head CBC saw I think any manufacturer that doesn't offer a saw jet isolates themselves from the largest segment of Cnc purchasing American companies. At a certain volume a saw jet becomes the only logical machine to own. It was my understanding that Breton held an Italian patent on the the technology/concept and they were the only Italian manufacturer that could sell the machine in Italy. And that's why the CMS sprint jet was only available in the us. Of course this all could have bee misinformation.

I just think another Italian sawjet would be a good thing. Prussiani has one now that also has lifters. It also has a five axis jet. A five axis jet, to me sounds incredible no matter the maintence.

It's very clear that a jet on a saw is a good thing IMO. My next machine if I had the space would be a sawjet to accompany my saw. Cnc saws are awesome but when you cut fragile materials, quartzites, and miter a lot having something to supplement ours would be nice at times.

We have operated sawjets for almost 8 years. Prior to that we operated an Omax water Jet for 5 years along with bridge saws.

I agree with Alex in that there will come a time/volume for each operator where a sawjet is the only real answer to a part of their production and I too lust for a 5 axis sawjet.

What I do not understand is all of this talk about the "high maintenance costs" associated with a sawjet.

My experience is that the cost per foot to operate a sawjet when considering the speed at which they cut, the accuracy, the flexibility, and the cost savings down stream; I do not see the "increased" costs of a sawjet vs a CNC saw.

How long does it take to cut curved pieces on a CNC Saw vs a Sawjet?

I do see the value of a CNC Saw in many applications, do not get me wrong on this, and a sawjet is more expensive to purchase then a CNC saw, and there is different maintenance associated with a jet, however, we did the tests and found that the operational cost per square foot per operating hour of a sawjet vs a CNC saw is at most, nominal. --I will not name of the CNC saw that we owned and used as a comparison, it was 8 years ago. Things may have changed but, I do not believe that it is that much.

Perhaps, it is the sales people of the manufacturers that do not have a sawjet in their portfolio that have promoted this issue of "higher costs". My question is "higher than what?"

I do not want every sales person chiming in defending their sales pitch without review-able documentation that supports their position. As the personals section says "Yours will get you Mine".

Only in my humble business metric based opinion.

Alex and Dave -
After running both CMC saw and Sawjet I couldn't disagree more. While sawjets are cool at first, the maintenance is an issue. One that in my opinion and based on our production tracking, is not outweighed by performance (sf processed).

Plus if I cut an arched piece or circle with the CNC saw, the finish of the cut is so much cleaner than that of a waterjet kerf. And in cutting a 60" diameter, it was faster. We tracked it to be certain.

What sawjet are you running?
And you cut a 60 inch circle with the CNC saw faster than a jet?
What was the waste when you did that and what speed were you cutting with the jet?
Did you hand finish the 60 inch circle or run on a cnc?
Can you cut a 16-inch circle on a CNC saw with a blade, how about a zero radius sink?

Faster cutting is faster cutting. Down stream savings may or may not be realized, depending on shop set & procedures. Cleaner cut is cleaner cut, not fair to keep changing the metric(s). Sounds more like the election!

Dave. I can cut a 12 3/4 circle with an 18 inch blade on my brio

Zero radius sink on my cnc saw? Sort of.....
The straights are cut with the blade. The corners are cleared by hand, on the outfeed table, with a Galeski jig saw. It may not be as fast as a saw jet, but for our operation, it works well, with a healthy return and no bank payment.

tim farr wrote:Dave. I can cut a 12 3/4 circle with an 18 inch blade on my brio

Great.
All outside corner raidus less than what -- 16 inch, will be with the finger bit.

If it is a saw blade than:
At what saw time?
At what waste amount?
And where will it be finished? By hand or on a CNC.

I did not want to start this because my issue was with the "maintenance cost of the waterjet".
No one has yet attempted to address that directly.

Here we go again......................

Dave.Scott wrote:

tim farr wrote:Dave. I can cut a 12 3/4 circle with an 18 inch blade on my brio

Great.
All outside corner raidus less than what -- 16 inch, will be with the finger.
If it is a saw blade than:
At what saw time?
At what waste ammount?
And where will it be finished? By hand or on a CNC.

I did not want to start this because my issue was with the "maintenance cost of the waterjet".
No one has yet attempted to address that directly.

No. Smaller than 6 3/8 radius gets cut in a straight line and the z wheel will make it good

Every shop has slightly different metrics and emphasis on different metrics.
Line machines are on and off the darling list continuously.
No doubt cnc saws will be more than enough for most small & medium shops. Jets may be mor suitable for larger scale shops or super custom shops.

A cnc saw and router is a powerful production combo for most shops (small & medium sized).

My post was to let others know about some of the things that GMM is up to. I sure did not want to start a debate about the pros and cons of saw jets. The question was brought up however, and I thought it proper to mention why after much time, effort and money, we did not go in that direction. (In the past I have sold some water jets, so I am at least passingly familiar with their use). Others may differ; hey, there are still Jets fans out there. Many firms, both manufacturers and users, have done quite well with saw jets, but to us, it seemed more logical to expand and further develop our sawing and routing technology. If we had gone the saw jet route, I don't think that we would be where we are today in other areas.

John Bergman
Bergman-Blair Machine Corp / GMM USA
Prescott, AZ 86305
928-443-1100
516-381-6774 Cell
bergmanblair@gmail.com