Polishing granite to mirror finish

[Mikeb]

Hello forum, i was sent here by a user at concretecountertops.com, so here goes.

I have a job which involves polishing two bathroom granite countertops.

Tools I have are a 4" disc variable speed makita polisher, and a DSC301 planetary polisher (just ordered this, have never used it).

The granite countertops are in ok condition, the client just basically wants a mirror like finish, the best available.

So how do i achieve mirror like finish on a granite countertop? It is a dark granite.

So far I have read about dry & wet polishing pads. They both have several steps, starting with 50 grit to 3000, then a buff. Is this enough to achieve a premium mirror finish? Why should i use wet? Or dry?

Are there any liquids, powder or paste that i can use in the final steps to get that mirror finish?

I found this system i dont know if anyone has used it, but it seems quite good; 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUgfvRWlhRo&sns=em

http://www.braxton-bragg.com/index.cfm/ ... 8448,9687/

What worries me is all these made in china diamond polishing pads, I really want the best finish possible and dont mind investing more in very good quality pads, IF IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE!

Can anyone recommend good quality diamond pads?


Thanks in advance for the help!

[dustinbraudway]

Mike that product won't do anything for you.

Can you take a pic of the stone and post it? Every stone is different and it really also is important to know where you are starting from? Is the stone already polished? Is it honed and they want it polished? Is it just dirty and needs to be cleaned and shined up (powder polished or paste) or is there a lot of etches and scratches and needs diamond polishing?

Ditch the idea of dry pads. That won't do anything for you.

Give us some feed back on the questions above so that we can help you out..

[kevinp]

Polishing granite surfaces is typically a task for an experienced professional. There are a lot of variables which will dictate the best method.
Some granites will not polish to a mirror finish.
Since you are asking these questions I would recommend hiring a professional.

You need to practice thoroughly before attempting this on someones countertops.

[Anneker]

I have used the Polishing Pro System with great success. Here is a link to their website http://www.polishingprosystems.com/

[kdnoel]

I have used the Polishing Pro System with great success. Here is a link to their website http://www.polishingprosystems.com/

It is customary here to post your name and where you are from... I think we all need a little more info before we give recommends....

[rtams]

Hi Mike,
The size of the countertops are the deciding factor on whether or not you want to tackle this job. My guess is, if it is actually granite then it does not need to be repolished, just cleaned or buffed. Have you ever polished granite edges? If not, then you really should not attempt this unless you are prepared to replace the stone when it is ruined. My guess is that you will spend a full 2 days top polishing and the polish may not be any better (if not worse) then when you started.
Price out new tops and you install them - you might end up saving a lot more money and headaches.

[Dan R.]

MIkeb and Anneker please post your information in the signature line, it is common courtesy here. Thank you.

I followed "the link to their website" that Anneker suggested (in third person) and by a huge coincidence, there was a guy there that invented the product who had the same last name . Imagine my shock in the astronomical odds of that happening, perhaps a distant cousin. And in a post that two first time posters chimed in on the same post, one with a problem, the other with a solution. Even more improbable timing.

I think that we have just been had by some gorilla marketing. It is flattering that there is enough respect for the SFA to believe what we think really matters in the industry (it does ). We do have sponsorships available for people who want to openly sell their products here. We even have a specified area (classified) for buying and selling odds and ends. To run a scheme like this might tend to hurt one's credibility, just guessing though.


FILL IN YOUR SIGNATURES.

[GuyboR]

Mikeb and Anneker,

It also seems strange that both of you joined the forum TODAY and one asks a question and one posts a solution....AS YOUR FIRST POSTS. But yet, neither of you posted your real names or companies? Care to share those with us?

[graffster]

And the pic posted wasn't a mirror finish to say the least

[Mikeb]

Hello again,

Ok i see people here are doubting my question. In the previous forum i introduced myself, and well i just forgot to do the same here, but i dont mind doing it again. It did bring a smile to my face though how suspicious you guys are.

My name is michael, im from the uk but currently living in santiago, chile. (maybe you can verify this with my IP address?) i have facebook also if u wanna check my history and pictures of where i am etc...

I dont know if that is enough info, i was sent here from another forum being told i could get help, that is what im after...and since im inexperienced i guess it only shows even more so if i found a product online that you guys dont consider any good. It was one of the top google searches!

Believe it or not here in chile there are not many companies that offer top quality polishing for granite. I work with comcrete floors so i have some experince with grinding machinery, even though i guess you guys will say it ia totally irrelevant and useless.

My aim for posting in this forum is to get feedback from you guys who are experts and have years of experience, forgive me if i fell formsoe gimmick product (am i the first todo so?)

I have some granite tops to practise on and i will obviously do so before touching anything belonging to a client.

I dont have all the info just yet because this is a new job and area we are trying to get into, but i was told that there is not much damage and just needs to be cleaned up and polished to look new i guess.

So from what useful information has been posted so far, dry pads are a no, and also pro polishing system, thats fine by me.

Ok, so wet polishing pads....which ones? All i can find are china made and i dont trust them too much. I dont mind spending a little bit more on top quality pads if they make the difference in the final result.

Another doubt i have, are there powders, liquids that can be used with these diamonds to get a nice finish?

I hope i have cleared up any doubts you regarding how authentic my interest is in this, i apologise for not introduxing myself, i just hope you guys can now find the time to give me tips on this.


....im also guessing the procpolishing system guy is constantly searching google to see where his product is mentioned, he obviously saw my question, signed up to reply, but like i said, i got here from another forum, infact i think it is the owner of this website that recommended this forum.

Thanks for your time, im all ears and eyes!

[Dan R.]

Mikeb, you certainly seem to know your way around the internet, filling out the signature line should be a piece of cake. Your IP address was tracked to Santiago Chile. The other newbie was on a satellite based web server, I believe.

Perhaps, you can understand some hesitation in answering questions to people that are being secretive (not posting signatures). The whole idea here is about sharing information and knowledge to legit people in the industry. Certainly, the root of what may be a possible suspicious coincident is evident in this thread, eh? You asked about the product and he answered (in quirky third person) in a very short time span. I would call that suspicious, not criminal, but certainly highly unusual. Please fill out your signature line.

My professional opinion is that attempting to repolish an entire granite top by hand with little to no experience is reckless.

Some specific information is required to answer your specific question. What type of granite? What type of damage? what size is the piece?

What is the actual value of attempting such a project? If you have experience in polishing and grinding, how much grinding can be done with 14,000 grit abrasive (grit in the propolish kit)? What does your experience and common sense tell you? Personally, I would be a little skeptical that a random orbital sander and some 14,000 grit powder could polish the back side of a typical piece of granite. Though, I have been wrong before.

Check out the sponsors (at the top of the page), they sell some quality gear for this purpose. Some pads are made in Korea, some in Italy and some in China. It is difficult to polish a full top by hand and achieve a great overall polish. The pressure by hand will be inconsistent and a real issue to deal with over the size of an entire top.

[Stone Dude]

Anneker is Steve Anneker, the inventor of the polishing pro system? You have used this system with success? How fascinating

I have never seen this system work properly out of 5 demos, and its always taken way too much time each time. You claim 8 years in developememt, yet use a different technique each time. Different speeds etc. After 8 years you think you'd have a procedure down. When the inventor can't make it happen during the demos, I dunno if it works

Mike, attempting to polish a counter top in someones home is a bad idea. It can easily turn out bad for you and the customer granite takes longer and is significantly harder than other stones, so once a mistake is made it is difficult or impossinle to recover

Some pastes and creams work very well and others not so well. The majority of your finish will come from mechanical abrasion, diamonds etc.

I would strongly suggest practing many times until you are comfortable

[dustinbraudway]

Mike, I sent you over from the concrete forum. Also I am not the owner. This is a non profit continuing education association.

As you can see there are many lukers who sell shady products always about and it brings up everyones attention when no one post their name and locations. Sorry it is this way on many sites as you know.

If you can get us some pics it might be easier to help you out.

Pads, everyone has their own that they like. Try clicking on one of our sponsors up top and look at their websites. I personally use Alpha and alot of others for Top Polishing. It is a technique that requires lots of practice. Refinishing stone is whole trade unto its own as well because there are many ways to do it and many stones act differently. No one is the same.

Any chance you can get a pic?

[Joe Little]

Very few professionals on this site who would attempt this in a home, personally I would not unless its absolutly necessary.
Most of us in the granite biz, understand is often ( or most of the time) cheaper to replace a granite top, verses re-polishing a whole top in the field. To get a factory /flat perfect finish by hand, in a home is not impossible, but very,very, very difficult and time consuming.

We will take a polished top and hone it in place because its a much easier task, and is doable and you can make a little money. But polishing a complete top is not worth the time it takes, and unless its perfect , you have wasted your time and will not get paid. = Not Winning !!!

Once you get a pic, it can be discussed just how difficult it would be, depending on the stone. There are a few tricks you can do to the stone if its just a little hazy, but as you know, trade secrets are earned, not given. Just a fact.

For the 250 membership, its not a costly expense and is well worth the money.

[jonnyrue]

I have used the Polishing Pro System with great success. Here is a link to their website http://www.polishingprosystems.com/

Dear Anneker

After purchasing your Polishing Pro System, I cannot believe the results. After rubbing your 14,000 grit polish into my girlfriend's face, I woke up next morning to find Christina Aguilera in bed with me. Should you require any written testimonials, please do not hesitate to contact me, and I would only be too happy to oblige.

Yours faithfully

[Nick]

Ahh dude.

That sucks his magic snake oil doesn't work. I read the webpage before I went further because I doubted it as well. It would be rad if you could buff on a mechanical polish with no skills, I guess I was just being blissfully ignorant in hoping that solution was finally brought to market

[t-mobile]

John, I think annikan skywalkers snake oil still has faults.... christina aguilerra hasnt been on the hot wagon for years


Joe little's post is spot on in my opinion.

[Nick]

John, I think annikan skywalkers snake oil still has faults.... christina aguilerra hasnt been on the hot wagon for years

So it like kinda works?

[timparker]

Hello All,
My name is Tim Parker, and I am part owner of Polishing Pro Systems, LLC. I was notified by one of our distributors about this blog, and the negative comments and assertions being made about our products.

First, I would like to address Mike B who is in living in Santiago, Chile. Mike, if you contact me through our website, I will personally send you a DVD showing how our system works. If, after you view the video, you want to take on this job for your customer, I will send you enough product to do the job-at no charge to you. I would only ask that after you polish the countertops, you would come back on this site and tell how the product worked for you. Although some of what you heard here about how polishing countertops is not for everyone is somewhat true, the reality is that our product works unquestionably. And, it is not as difficult as you are being told. If you follow the instructions, you can do this job and you will be quite profitable doing so.

Another suggestion made by some on this site is to check out their sponsors. We agree. Check out Braxton-Bragg. They are one of the SFA's sponsors. You will not only find our products being sold by them, but you can find us demonstrating our system in their trade show booths. Braxton-Bragg is not going to allow this if our system does not work. Braxton-Bragg has sold quite a significant number of our polishing kits, and if you don't believe me, you can contact them directly. In fact, we often get technical calls from fabricators around the country that have been referred to us by Braxton-Bragg. Again, this is not insignificant. Do not be deterred by some of the negativity that you have received at this forum. We do not sponsor this site or advertise on this site because we only sell directly to qualified and reputable distributors. We do not sell directly to end users. We rely on our distributors to do the advertising and marketing for us.

As for those of you who have commented negatively about the results of our system. My question to you is simply this: have you ever even used this system? If you have actually used it, and did not get the results that you expected, I offer you to contact me as well, and tell me specifics of the problem that you have faced. We have NEVER been notified by any person who has actually used this system properly that suggested that it did not work.

If however, you have used this forum simply to denigrate a product that you have never even used, then perhaps that explains why you were so excited that someone thought that it actually mattered what was said here.

Tim Parker
Co-owner
Polishing Pro Systems, LLC

[Stone Dude]

As for those of you who have commented negatively about the results of our system. My question to you is simply this: have you ever even used this system? If you have actually used it, and did not get the results that you expected, I offer you to contact me as well, and tell me specifics of the problem that you have faced. We have NEVER been notified by any person who has actually used this system properly that suggested that it did not work.

Tim, I have watched this system demo'd by the inventor of this system 5 (FIVE) times. each time with a different process, different explanation and different results. Out of these 5 times I have never seen satisfactory results. I comment negatively because out of the 5 times I have seen it in action used by the inventor, and the 1 single person who I have talked to that actually purchased this system, it has a 100% failure rate.

every time the stone was either orange peeled, or failed to produce a satisfactory finish.

Also, speaking of negativity, I witnessed Steve Anneker making shitty comments about Kris Jorgenson in St Louis at the Mega Workshop last year. Kris was performing a demonstration of top polishing after one of his seam demo's. Kris did not hear the remarks, but I did as well as about half a dozen other people. Out of nowhere for no reason. He was with one of the Braxton Bragg guys, I dont remember who but he seemed to be a ncie guy. He made a comment about how rediculous the process was that Kris was using and turned to the BB guy with a smile on his face and said "should I get my bag? I should get my bag. I'll be right back". He then proceeded to to destroy a piece of Uba Tuba after Kris had yielded a perfectly polished finish

all of this was unprovoked. it was a bad start from the get go.

This system costs more and takes longer than other combinations, and has yet to be proven.

thats why I made the negative comments.
If however, you have used this forum simply to denigrate a product that you have never even used, then perhaps that explains why you were so excited that someone thought that it actually mattered what was said here.

if it doesnt matter, why did you sign up to post?
Tim Parker
Co-owner
Polishing Pro Systems, LLC

[ageless]

I'm a witness to what Cameron is talking about in St Louis. I didn't hear what was said, but I did see his attempt. Wasn't impressed.

Mikeb, like others have said, without pictures, it's hard to recommend a procedure. It might be an easy fix or it could be just a waste of your time. Take Tim up on his free offer, it might work for your.

[Dan R.]

Or cost you 2 tops, untold dollars and a soiled reputation. How bad could it be? The tops and then money are easily salvaged, but the reputation takes a bit longer to repair.

0 for 5 is not impressive.

[coolhandchris]

Hello All,
My name is Tim Parker, and I am part owner of Polishing Pro Systems, LLC. I was notified by one of our distributors about this blog, and the negative comments and assertions being made about our products.


Tim Parker
Co-owner
Polishing Pro Systems, LLC

1. This isn't a blog.
2. Are you sure you weren't notified by the other co owner who posted above you?

[CNG]

Hello All,
My name is Tim Parker, and I am part owner of Polishing Pro Systems, LLC. I was notified by one of our distributors about this blog, and the negative comments and assertions being made about our products.

First, I would like to address Mike B who is in living in Santiago, Chile. Mike, if you contact me through our website, I will personally send you a DVD showing how our system works. If, after you view the video, you want to take on this job for your customer, I will send you enough product to do the job-at no charge to you. I would only ask that after you polish the countertops, you would come back on this site and tell how the product worked for you. Although some of what you heard here about how polishing countertops is not for everyone is somewhat true, the reality is that our product works unquestionably. And, it is not as difficult as you are being told. If you follow the instructions, you can do this job and you will be quite profitable doing so.

Another suggestion made by some on this site is to check out their sponsors. We agree. Check out Braxton-Bragg. They are one of the SFA's sponsors. You will not only find our products being sold by them, but you can find us demonstrating our system in their trade show booths. Braxton-Bragg is not going to allow this if our system does not work. Braxton-Bragg has sold quite a significant number of our polishing kits, and if you don't believe me, you can contact them directly. In fact, we often get technical calls from fabricators around the country that have been referred to us by Braxton-Bragg. Again, this is not insignificant. Do not be deterred by some of the negativity that you have received at this forum. We do not sponsor this site or advertise on this site because we only sell directly to qualified and reputable distributors. We do not sell directly to end users. We rely on our distributors to do the advertising and marketing for us.

As for those of you who have commented negatively about the results of our system. My question to you is simply this: have you ever even used this system? If you have actually used it, and did not get the results that you expected, I offer you to contact me as well, and tell me specifics of the problem that you have faced. We have NEVER been notified by any person who has actually used this system properly that suggested that it did not work.

If however, you have used this forum simply to denigrate a product that you have never even used, then perhaps that explains why you were so excited that someone thought that it actually mattered what was said here.

Tim Parker
Co-owner
Polishing Pro Systems, LLC

Hi Tim,

I think Cameron covered it well, but I just have one other comment. To suggest that someone, with no experience, can go and surface polish granite is reckless and irresponsible. There are so many different stones out there. Some hard. Some soft. Some both. You wanna guarantee your product will work for this guy, put the money to replace the tops in trust with a lawyer, send him your product and let him have it at. If it works, I'll send you the money for the product and you'll get your money back. When it doesn't, at least he can have someone replace the tops for him with no cost to him.

Mikeb -- I have learned so much from the SFA in a little over a year. If you are seriously considering doing this, the $250 a year is the best money you will ever spend. The support, education and training provided by guys and gals that have been doing this for years has no monetary value. It's priceless.

My .02 anyways.....

[Antonio Almonte]

Proof is in the pudding.

If the inventor could not produce satisfactory results in 5 tries then.......

BTW, Cameron is our resident stone restoration expert and knows his stuff. Also, Kris is a long time member here and to make those remarks about Kris and the top polishing system he was using ( a system that is proven many many times over in front of audiences ) was uncalled for and then could not produce a factory finish back, then........